Adam, Dan, Pete and I did some work last weekend on the butt-slide section of Highlands Sky. It became pretty obvious that having a battery powered chainsaw would be a real asset to the club for the trail work that we do. Dan brought one of his gas powered ones, it ended up spilling a ton of gas everywhere, and we did the work with hand saws instead. They're heavy and loud and it's fussy to have to keep several kinds of gas around. My feeling is that modern battery powered ones are more than powerful enough for what we do, since the tech has gotten better in recent years.

It's a little bit reactionary to one irritating experience, but I think the need is there no matter what.

I reached out to Donald Marsh--friend of the club, Highlands runner and trail worker, and Stihl salesman--for some recommendations of what model might be appropriate and whether Stihl did any discounts for non-profits. He reported that there is a 20% discount he can offer on anything we'd like for 501(c)3s. He also offered that he would personally donate the saw if we purchased the battery (at that discounted rate). If we want to go that route, he's very willing to help us pick out a good one based on his knowledge of what gets returned a lot, size, the sort of work we do, etc.

Another thing I think we should consider is if we ought to buy two of them -- one for the North trailer / locker and one for the South. I don't know if the folks in the South have a need for one, but if they do, that feels like it might be equitable.

Are there any chainsaws that belong to the Club? If there are, or if we decide to buy them, I would recommend that we make sure there is a safety and equipment loan policy for who is allowed to use them, and how they check them out and return them to the gear storage, and maintenance standards. Nothing more annoying than having someone borrow a tool with good intentions and returning it broken or dirty. I would also recommend that we outline what safety requirements volunteers must have to be allowed to borrow Club tools.  For example, if cutting on FS trails do they have the required FS Sawyer training. This may all exist already, but if it does not I would recommend we include for risk management.

Posted by: @ianvoysey

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They're heavy and loud and it's fussy to have to keep several kinds of gas around.

Whoops! When I said "they" here, I meant gas powered chainsaws, not hand saws.

I believe the club does not currently own any chainsaws. We have several gas-powered hedge trimmers and an assortment of hand tools, like you've seen at the HS40 training weekend, but I think the chainsaws used in the past have been privately owned by Dan or Randy Young or other folks.

I know that we've historically been very careful about following FS regulations about sawyer training and not using powered tools in the wrong areas. I definitely agree we should continue to do so, and maybe have some kind of written policy about what training someone needs before they can use the most dangerous things that's in line with how it's been.

I don't know if there is a policy about tool borrowing, but I see your concern there too, Emily. I think in the past the similar tools have only been used at club work days and not really available for any member to borrow. I would not want to start having a general purpose lending library of tools, but I would want anyone putting on a Fun Run or a Race or with other vested interest to be able to use things we have---much like they might want to use the big red start line clock.

@ianvoysey Thanks, Ian. I agree with all you are sharing. I am sure the standards, guidelines, and approved practices are already being followed by those in leadership who know them, and I also don't think I would want to openly open up tool use to just any member, which is why if we are purchasing equipment owned by the Club I think there should be a vetting process to determine that those who are using the equipment are fully qualified and have written permission from the Club leadership to do so. As we grow (as I am hopeful we will continue to grow!) with enthusiastic volunteers, I think it will be important to have a plan in place on how to responsibly include those newer volunteers in trail work practices. Perhaps a written standard that determines how, when, and who has permission to use the Club owned equipment. Again, this may already exist and I may just be unaware. 

As far as your original proposal to purchase equipment rather than only relying on folks' personal gear, it seems like a great idea if the budget supports. For the discussion of gas powered or battery powered, I will defer to others on that decision.

@emilyhuguenin, currently we only own two Stihl hedge trimmers. No saws. One for North and one for South, purchased in 2017.  I have the North trimmers in my garage and I assume Dolin or Bob has the South trimmers. 

That's one negative of purchase more durable goods.  Who will be responsible for housing, caring, maintenance, etc . . .

With that said, I am supportive of the purchase. I do believe that if we were to purchase chainsaw/s, that we should consider electric -- because of the weight, ease of use, less maintenance, and less likely that the respective club members using them already have one.  I have a lighter Stihl, gas-powered, 16" bar that has served me well for many years of trail maintenance.  Gas has many benefits as a "daily use" saw and I likely would not choose electric for my personal use, but electric has many benefits specifically for trail work.

Here is our current policy on borrowing equipment (this can be found on the website under "Member's Benefits" (pw: dollysods2009):

The club has some items that it purchases for use at races, events, and for promotion. Some of this items are also available for club members to use. Club members must be in good standing to borrow equipment. Use of equipment is restricted to activities related to club events, races, and other events related to running. Equipment is for volunteer work only and it must be return within 30 days. Here are the items that are available:

• Stihl hedge trimmers are available. Purchased in Fall 2017, they are great for widening of cutting back brush. Also works horizontally like a weed-wacker with good results.

@ianvoysey, do you have any idea how much of a cost we would be looking at if we purchased two saws?

Yes, we comply with all land-owner regulations with power tool operation.

As a side point, maybe we can discuss this in-person in July, the idea of the club reimbursing x-number of club member chainsaw certifications through the Forest Service.  Two my knowledge, we only have two or three club members that are chainsaw certified.

Posted by: @acasseday

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@ianvoysey, do you have any idea how much of a cost we would be looking at if we purchased two saws?

Not very precisely. I did some quick searching on the Stihl site and it seems like it might be something in the ballpark of $400 per saw with one battery each. But I don't know anything about saws and I don't know exactly which one we'd want. The actual out of pocket cost to the club is hard to estimate if we take Donald up on his kind offer (even if he only donates one of two saws we might choose to buy).

My feeling is that we should take Donald up on his offer of a donated saw and purchased battery, be advised by him in making a choice of an appropriate saw, and have that for upcoming 17-18 May HS40 work weekend, then have a more compete discussion about a second saw, training policy for operating saws, and possible reimbursement for training as Adam suggests at the in person July meeting.

Perhaps a motion approving up to a certain amount of money to make that plan happen would suffice for now?

We can own one saw for a few months and not add it to the list of available gear for borrowing, I think. That may let us have the tool for the work coming up without rushing into anything or without holding back good resources from our membership for too long.

@ianvoysey, I agree fully.  We would be crazy not to take Donald up on his kind offer in donating a saw.  I say we get the saw, pay for the battery, have it to use for the Highlands trail work, then assess purchasing a second when we meet in-person in July.

I did a little digging and the charger and battery appear to be around $350, retail.  I'm assuming our cost then to be around $280 with the 20% discount offer.

Here's the specifics from him, hot off the iMessage presses:

I’ll donate a MSA200 chainsaw. In the commercial line of 4 saws with 1 being smallest and 4 being biggest it’s number 2. It should handle 90% of what we clean up. Has a 14” bar on it.

An AP300S battery would be $240 and a AL301 charger would be $88.

That's a $380 saw that he's giving us: https://www.acmetools.com/stihl-msa-200-c-b-14-inch-bar-battery-powered-chainsaw-bare-tool-ma03-200-0007/S0000000003453.html?msclkid=df1393efd9b910cb6f57fbeec42d40f4&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=Shopping-National-Search%20Only-Profit%20Margin%20Target-19-20&utm_term=4581596254970749&utm_content=Profit%20Margin%2019%25%20-%2020%25

Those batteries sure are expensive though!

I move that we:

• accept a donation of a Stihl MSA200 chainsaw from Donald Marsh, to be stored with the North equipment
• spend up to $350 on a battery and charger for that saw (amount depending tax and discount, likely a AP300S battery and AL301 charger)
• discuss the possible purchase of a second saw, a policy about loaning and use of chainsaws, and reimbursement of chainsaw training at the July meeting.

@acasseday I like this idea as a discussion for the Annual Meeting. I would also suggest adding to that discussion, potential opportunities for Trail Maintenance Training workshops. My colleague teaches these hands-on workshops across the state for volunteers and nonprofit groups and could be something we could explore for our members. I am not sure if there is a cost to attend, I can have more information ready for the Meeting.